Women & the Veil!!
This is a topic that intrigues me and I have always wanted to write something about it, but I am not going to discuss whether we as women must or must not wear the veil as this is a point that has been exhausted with debate and discussions; it is one of these points that you cannot get something out of discussing them as each has his/her own conviction about it; so let’s just stay out of it.
I bet you are wondering now; if I don’t want to discuss the above-mentioned point, why am I bringing this issue up? And what is it that I want to discuss?
There is a certain thing that inspired this post; it is the fact that the society or maybe we can say people, have found another way to discriminate against women. We keep hearing news about how country X is forcing women to wear the veil in public places and how country Y is forcing them not to. We also hear about countries who don’t go as far as setting a public policy with or against the veil, but at the same time go by undeclared policies that determines how the public thinks, feels or reacts about women wearing or not wearing the veil.
It is a fact that women have and still do suffer from discrimination in any society, eastern or western, all the same. Each society has its own conceptions and misconceptions about women and where they stand in that society. Some societies or maybe all of them believe that women are taking away some of men’s rights and privileges by going out and being working productive individuals; coming from the “women belong at home” mentality. The funny thing is that they act differently when it comes to this specific point; we all know that women are paid less than their men counterparts for the same jobs, but this needs a separate post on its own.
Back to the veil issue and what brought it up on this blog. As usual; I was going through VIVA for this month and came across the VIVA Report; it is a piece by Laura Haddad about this very issue and it is titled; “Lifting the Veil”. Laura reports that she investigated the veil issue in our society and came with some disturbing facts that are worth sharing; that is exactly why I chose to write about this.
60% of women in Jordan choose to wear the veil; I say choose because we do not have public policies that force women to wear or not wear the veil. However; it seems that we do have undeclared policies against veiled women; Laura reports that the discrimination reached an extent that veiled women are not allowed in some restaurants and/or café’s in Amman. It has reached a point where a veiled woman’s choice of places to hang out is not hers anymore, it is rather made for her by such places’ owners and I think this is barbaric and a shame on our society in the first place.
Also; veiled women suffer from discrimination when it comes to applying for jobs; mainly in the private sector. The report mentions stories of real women whose job applications were rejected because they chose to be veiled.
As much as I am appalled by such actions and hidden policies; I am also angered by the fact that these women do not stand for themselves and practice their rights, given to them by the law and constitution. Why do they accept such insults without doing anything? I can understand that they will not be able to do anything when they are rejected after a job interview, because not all business owners say it clearly that the reason for rejection is the veil, however; when it happens in any other context, why accept it and turn the other way? Who will get you your right if you yourself would not do anything to help the cause?
Some of the very important points mentioned in the report is that wearing the veil has become the epitome of close-mindedness and backwardness; it is a common misconception these days that if a woman is wearing the veil, she cannot be sophisticated or open minded and by default is oppressed and does not own her decisions. 60% of Jordanian women are oppressed because they are veiled; I find this silly and not logical.
If we want to explore this point a bit deeper; it is quite the contrary; if a woman can make the veil choice freely, isn’t that open minded and the exact opposite of oppression? In fact; I am really proud and delighted that we do have the choice, because when one decides to wear or not wear the veil, she can be comfortable with her choice, except now, they have found a new way to make her question this choice and maybe become afraid to take the step.
Another interesting point in the report is that the discrimination can go the other way around; meaning that in certain parts of the country, or maybe even Amman itself, not wearing the veil is almost equal to a woman perceived as a slut, which makes women in these areas wear the veil because of cultural pressures and not because of religious reasons. I can strongly relate to this point as I do not wear the veil and I live in a close conservative community where 98.99% of women and girls are veiled, making me stand in the crowd as a misfit and out of the ordinary. I can confidently tell you from personal experience that I am treated with discrimination all the time, but I have always stood up for myself and my rights.
Why do other people’s choices of clothing or lifestyle affect us? Does modernization mean westernization? Why is it perceived that veiled women are oppressed and ignorant while unveiled women are modern and sophisticated? Why are we (women) being judged by a piece of fabric? Why does its existence or the lack of it determine how we are treated in our community and even determine our career level, places we hang at or even the choice of a life partner? When does this narrow mindedness and double standards stop ruling our lives and how we interact in our communities?
I remember that when HM Queen Rania was interviewed by Oprah; a whole part of the show was dedicated to talk about the veil and Oprah brought that up to HM the queen; to which she answered that the message we are trying to promote is: “judge a woman by what’s in her head, not what’s on her head”; I couldn’t have said that better even if I tried to.
Thank you Laura for the great report and I really wish that these places that do not allow veiled women in to be published so that women can stand up for their rights and do something about the issue. The way I see the whole thing; it is about us women and how we choose to lead our lives. I am not veiled, but I certainly do not accept that veiled women get discriminated against and be treated in such a humiliating manner; it is just appalling and primitive to be thinking this way. It seems that a lot of damage has been done to our society and religion at the same time; and it our own doing; religion is being hijacked by extremists and unfortunately; the true spirit of it was lost along the way; what a pity and a big shame!!
Update!!
I scanned the report for those of you who can’t get the magazine; enjoy!
Click on the images to enlarge and get a clear view 
October 20th, 2006 at 6:01 pm
let me start by saying thanks for writing this post
let me continue by saying any article or “report” that seeks to put some number, such as 60%, as one that reflects a choice, is going out on a limb, a very far and frail limb. the government doesn’t have any policy pro or anti hijab and it will stay like that unless of course extremists overthrow the regime God forbid and then we all know what happens.
anyways
about discrimination concerning jobs interviews. if no woman wore hijab in jordan you would still have discrimination. attractive women will be hired and ugly women rejected. american tv shows like 20/20 and 60 minutes, heck even extreme makeover, have put this to the test over and over again. there is constant discrimation where a woman is judged superficially. thats just the sad reality.
this issue goes back to demographics…where you come from in Jordan…the reality is it’s west amman versus the rest of the country. for the most part the rest of the country is more socially conservative and wears the hijab, the culture of that environment practically makes it a must. for the most part not many wear the hijab in west amman.
what do demographics imply? west amman is the more modern by industrial standards and since standards of living are usually higher there you therefore have the perception those that live in west amman are culturally and socially more modern (perhaps in a superior way) in comparision to the rest of the country that is seen as poor, conservative and therefore by default percieved to be backwards and rigid. this, for the most part, is an accurate assessment of the reality of our country and it’s polarity.
as long as those two parts of the country stay seperated by the walls of modernism we will have no problem. this of course never happens and what you have is a fish out of water situation where, usually, those in the east venture in to the west. those in the west very rarely leave that environment except for the rare occassion to go visit the rest of the country where they are percieved as “just another tourist”. but like i said it is the east invading the west, mainly for economic reasons and factoring in geography means its mostly east ammanis coming into west amman. the people of the former will tend to (on some level) look down on the former and this is going to increase as the rich are getting richer and the poor poorer at a much faster rate than ever before. cultural colonization induced by economic needs.
this is kind of stereotyped in an abu mahjoob cartoon: http://mahjoob.com/en/archives/view.php?cartoonid=1514
anyways, it’s almost impossible to serperate this issue without involving demographics. afterall we are talking about a culture clash, and there need to be two elements in order for some impact to take place.
October 20th, 2006 at 6:28 pm
I guess I have 3 points to make:
- Thank you Laura for the great report and I really wish that these places that do not allow veiled women in to be published so that women can stand up for their rights and do something about the issue. – Allow me to start by saying, veiled women should have no more and no less rights than unveiled women, they both have to be equal. Asserting that, I see that women (nor men) have any rights violated in the issues you raised. Saying that any rights are being violated is a misconception.
- Companies, and the private sector in particular, have no obligation whatsoever to hire anyone. If the management has any policies regarding not hiring veiled women and\or hiring women in general for lower salaries this is perfectly within the company’s rights. No law should exist to counter that. Same goes for cafes or whatever privately owned hangout place.
The above two points were regarding legal issues, and although i believe them to be fair, they by no means represent my feelings towards the issue.
- As you might imagine, I am an atheist, which means that I try to strip issues from their religious background. In short I handle an issue like the veil as pure choice of clothing disregarding its religious weight, but this approach isnt particularly suitable in all cases. Taking things to a personal level; I generally like to believe that veiled women had no choice in wearing it (at least at a subconscious level not a physical one), as (i believe) a veil is a sign of dishonesty (in the sense that a person hiding something is dishonest – by definition)!!
October 20th, 2006 at 6:38 pm
[...] Women & the Veil!! in Mind I’m not too pleased that some have chosen to label her as the ‘Muslim’ Barbie or doll. I don’t think that is necesarily correct. Someone saw a niche/potential and created her. Arab kids are identifiying with her because she looks less foreign that is all. [...]
October 20th, 2006 at 9:06 pm
hey khalidah, i check your blog every day, when i get the chance, and im always interested in your posts, as for this one, talking about the article in VIVA, i -shahinaz!!- had 2 stories mentioned in it. after reading your thoughts and how you are wondering why wont we do anything about it, it’s just simple…when u are ignorant about the law and rights you have in your own country, this is what happens…and when u feel disgusted of that kind of people you meet in your life, this is the reaction, silence! and when you try to forget what you have heard in an interview and try again some where else and find the same “rules” you just start to give up, especially when you have no one to support you! and hearing all this kind of stories, u start to think: “how can I make a difference?” as for me when i decided to take a chef assistant course, -being the first female in Jordan to have a degree in both, nutrition and cooking-, i found a huge support from my prrofessors and some executive chefs in Amman, but after i got it all, reality life shocked me! sometimes i was refused because i would be the only femeale working in the kitchen, and other times “simply” because im wearing hijab! and what isnt mentcioned in the article is that while i was having that interview with the french executive chef at that 5 stars hotel – i wish i can give names- i tried to make him understand that it’s more hygenic to be covering my hair inside a kitchen!! but of course, it’s not his decision, it’s the hotel’s policy! and it was a waste of time…
after being rejected several times, for almost 2 years, for the job i want, and for the ideas i still have in mind -combining between nutrition and healthy cooking- i started to give up, and got the chance to work in different fields, where i was accepted, even though im wearing a scarf!
now i moved to the states, with my husband, hoping to have a better chance here!
thanks for reading…
nido
October 20th, 2006 at 9:52 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87nX_31BzkY&mode=related&search=
pls watch, and enjoy
October 20th, 2006 at 10:08 pm
one more:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7VSU6VpRXU&mode=related&search=
October 20th, 2006 at 11:04 pm
Exactly 5o5a!
Thanks for the post…I realy can’t understand how people judge women by thier cloths…it’s a choice like every other choice…every one claims to give women thier rights but every thing is different when it comes to veil!
October 21st, 2006 at 12:22 am
Nas,
You are welcome … it is great to see you here …
I agree with your analysis and it does make sense, however; the article disturbingly mentions that these places do not look beyond the veil and do not differentiate between a rich veiled woman or a poor one; it is the scarf that intimidates them … because of so many misconceptions …
You are so right about the differences we see in the community and how they are affecting us and not to the best … thank you again
Devil’s Mind,
Welcome back my friend, where have you been hiding?
Thank you for the comment; regarding the first 2 points you have raised, actually the rights have been violated severely, not only as women but also as humans. I have scanned and included the article here so that you can read for yourself and see that they have included what the law says about such matters, so there are in fact some laws that govern this but I guess the majority are not aware of them and that’s why they get violated.
As for your third point, you are generalizing here as not all veiled women are trying to hide something or are dishonest; I cannot deny that we see this model all the time but this does not necessarily mean that it applies to all … just like the generalization that all unveiled women are bad or impolite ..
Nido,
Thank you so much for visiting my blog and for this comment; I am glad that you chose to speak out and share your experience with the world; this will definitely help others know their rights and defend them when they need to …
When I read about the issue with the 5-star hotel and how they ignorantly rejected your application just because your veiled, my first thought was anger and frustration, but then I thought that you are much better off without them because you don’t have to deal with this stupidity on daily basis …
Although it is sad that you could not find your opportnity here and had to go to a foreign country to seek open mindedness .. I really wish you and your husband all the best and please keep coming back to this blog and you are always welcome to comuunicate
Abdullah,
Thank you for the links .. however; they are completely irrelevant to this post as we are not discussing the veil choice … I stated in the first paragraph that I am staying away from this discussion because it is beside the point of this specific post … but I allowed your comments because some of the readers may be interested in watching …
Rasha,
Yeah … we are so far away from getting all our rights .. we get one and we lose 10 … we need more persistence and commitment on our part to gain these rights and defend them
October 21st, 2006 at 12:35 am
[...] Posted on Saturday 21 October 2006 Tags: arab world, hijab, Islam, Society, veil, WomenKhalidah wrote a very interesting post about Women & the Veil, and because my comment was too long for a comment I decided to make this post. [...]
October 21st, 2006 at 12:46 am
interesting to read your blog and comments. I think we should make a distinction between the hijab and niqab. All women have the right to wear what they want (to a certain extent!) but I think others have rights too. The niqab (veil) is the subject at issue in the UK not the hijab. I find women wearing the niqab intimidating and it seems to be a cultural issue rather than a religious one. We can all make decisions what to wear and if they are at the extremes of society then people will make comments and have opinions. T
October 21st, 2006 at 1:40 am
Okkkkkkkkk I dont know where to start or what to say exactly but I will try to list it in points:
1. I went to most of the cafes and restaurants in Amman and I saw veiled women in all those places , So please i really would like to know the names of the places where veil is not allowed becoz i would love to go there and see what they are going to say or do to let them know that what they are doing is against law , religion , principles , and womens rights! ( w akeed mish 7aykon had bel7aky )! So plzzzzzzzz If anyone is sure about a place of these let me know .
2. I think this is not the only type of discrimintation we face here in Jordan. Sometimes you may be not accepted for a certain job becoz you are not beautiful , not classy, conservative (even if you are not wearing the veil) , you are not living in western Amman …. etc I think its another sign of how shallow we are !
3. I agree that there is a very wrong idea taken about women who dont wear veil in certain parts of Jordan “elmana6e2 elsha3beyeh” and that is not becoz the people there are religious , some of them dont even know how to pray ! its becoz they are undeveloped!
4. God has asked women to wear the veil becoz God doesnt want people to judge women by how they look , no , women should be judged by their characters , their minds, and their hearts not by how attractive and beautiful they are !
5. I agree with Khalidah that women and all people should stand for this stupid and ignorant discrimination.
Thank you Laura and Khalidah for bringing up this issue!
October 21st, 2006 at 3:47 am
I personally don’t have a problem with a woman’s choice to wear or to not wear the veil. Nevertheless, I’ll try to do my best to come up with a possible explanation for the following question:
Today’s modern society has evolved to the point where many women have the freedom to choose to wear or not wear the veil. However there was a time when the option did not exist and the veil was forced upon all women (in some countries this is still compulsory, while other countries may not officially require the wearing of the veil but utilize strong social pressure to observe the hijab). Because of the traditional enforcement of the wearing of the veil, most Western societies have come to view the veil as a coerced issue upon women and therefore symbolic of oppression. They fail to see that it may be the free decision of the woman to wear the veil (I use the word “may” to emphasize again that such a choice is not always available to women in certain countries).
In other words, Westerners have based their ideals concerning the veil from age-old veil traditions as well as mixed signals from the differing Islamic opinions concerning veil requirements.
October 21st, 2006 at 7:32 am
Assalamu 3ala man itaba3a alhuda waba3d,
I had left this post of your for later to read, and now as I read it I would like to pause at the following points and say:
1. The first point to that you don’t want to discuss, which is wearing hijab (if that what you mean by veil) is truly out of discussion table as when Allah and then his prophet decree a matter believers have no choice but to follow with fully contented hearts. As this can be the line between believe and not believe.
2. In a society where Sharee3a does not rule, women rights like any other individual rights will be a victim, so don’t expect to have protected rights except in Sharee3a ruled society.
3. The current attack on women of hijab, because hijab has became a symbol of the committed Muslim woman, and the war against Islam even in Muslim countries extend further to discriminate against men with beards as well. Both men and women who chose Islam as their way of life have to stand fast for their choice as they should expect that (bada2a alislamu ghareeban wa saya3oodu ghareeban, fa6oba lilghoruba2).
4. As for men who associate not wearing hijab with being a slut, their experience in life and societies is limited, and they only experienced women with no hijab who are sluts. That not to be taken negative on either side, as for the man and woman with limited experience they are just people with a near experience with the clean society where women obey their Lord, and only ones who do not are usually sluts in that society. They have not got out and experienced other societies where disobeying Allah is the norm. On the other side a woman can be so clean inside yet she chose to put herself in the category of the disobeying women so she should comply with her Lords commands or expect all kind of labeling and looks that san her as a sex object as she chose that route “adna an yu3rafna fala yu2thayna”.
5. As for standing for woman rights in her choice to wear or not to wear hijab, this can apply in a western society where Sharee3a does not rule, but in a Muslim society where Sharee3a at least may rule inside the people rather ruled by the Governments there is no choice here as the choice become to be a believer or not. Islam cannot be taken in pieces, or parts. Either take it as a whole with every little detail or leave it as a whole. Then your choice of belief is guaranteed by Sharee3a any way (of course born Muslims have to think many times before rejecting Islam in a Muslim society because that is Ridda which carries another sever penalty)
6. As for “in the report is that wearing the veil has become the epitome of close-mindedness and backwardness” that is the western media and propaganda try to invade our societies with this kind of thinking. They are trying to spread the idea by saying it that way instead of direct attack. In the contrary Khalida, pick any man in the street and even the most “sarsari” and ask him if picking on a mu7ajabah woman considered for him as a waste of time or not, he will say yes it is as he knows that most who wear hijab they have the morality of hijab that makes his effort to pick up a woman in vain. So the respect is there, as for education veiled women have proven themselves so need to even discuss that here.
7. As for open mindness, the term can be double edge sword my friend and depends on the intention of the one who caries the sword what way he or she want use it. And that by itself need another post.
8. As for your question” Does modernization mean westernization?” The west certainly want you to believe so, as that’s their vehicle to deliver to you their values (if they have any) system so you won’t resist it. We are free willed people that believe in Allah and Islam and we reserve the right to be modernize in the way we see fit with our faith, if any what so called modernization comply with our standards we accept as we are like what our beloved said “ al7ikmatu dhalat almu2mun, aynama wajadaha fahwa a7qu beha”. We don’t need the west to tell s how we can think (buzz off)
9. As for “judge a woman by what’s in her head, not what’s on her head” of course that is true in a non-Muslim society, in a Muslim society that is not true as the society will judge comfortably with no guilt that the one who does not cover she choose to be a rejecter of Allah’s commands, and as such she can be labeled, not dwelling more of her character, as that is going beyond the evidence.
10. Finally sometimes a true word can be said but as they say” Kalimatu 7aqin yuradu beha ba6il” as the pressure on our society to westernize it and penetrate it and spread immorality in it increases, their methods varies as they have researched human beings and know who to get to them to at least shake their set of values so their set can invade. As for the strong in their belief this is merely nonsense.
Interesting post Khokha,
Happy 3eid for all
Note: I have not reviewed the comment for spelling and grammer, so please , forgive me as I am in a hurry to go. J
October 21st, 2006 at 8:05 am
I think you misunderstood me Khalida. I was not saying that veiled women are dishonest; Quite the contrary! What I am saying is that under “normal conditions”, I would consider the veil as a sign of dishonesty, but in the case of our conservative society, I view it more as a herd mentality (and sometimes as implied force) rather than dishonesty.
And for your question, about where I’ve been hiding… Well, for the time being, I prefer to retain my status as a frequent reader yet seldom commentator on your blog!
October 21st, 2006 at 9:28 am
ma3lish Khokha but this link was dropped from the above, but this time its relevant
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkXPHTnXOuQ&search=Haram%20Islaam%20Nasheed%20Video%20Islam%20deen%20anashed
October 21st, 2006 at 9:24 pm
There are two texts on the Veil that I have found extremely interesting. One is from an anthropological perspective (it is in French) and the other deals with the sacred/profane aspects of the Veil (in English). Both touch on the profound meaning of the Veil and the extent to which within the same community it is an inherent element of the identity not only of the female person who wears it, but as well as part of the identity of the male counterpart.
L’amour de la Loi
First their Veil, then my Cross
October 22nd, 2006 at 12:00 am
The funny thing is that they act differently when it comes to this specific point; we all know that women are paid less than their men counterparts for the same jobs, but this needs a separate post on its own.
A brief point, Khalidah, about this comment, even though I know you didn’t want to make it the topic of this discussion.
At least in the United States this commonly heard “fact” isn’t really true. Women may make less than men in the same profession for the same total amount of time but that is largely because women are much more likely to take time off from their careers to raise children. Needless to say, put a hold on your career for a few years and then resume that career at a later period, you aren’t going to be in the same place as a co-worker who has been there the same number of years but has been there continuously.
Studies that take this factor into account find a negligible difference in the pay of men and women in the United States.
October 23rd, 2006 at 7:37 am
Thank you for discussing this topic. You covered it from so many angles, and got so many interesting comments, that there is really nothing left for me to say! By the way, I am not veiled.