Low Morals … or No Morals!!
What is the connection between the events that took place in Egypt on the first day of Eid and the uncovered meat vs. cats’ theory? What makes hundreds of men (although I can’t and won’t describe them as men, but that’s how they are classified anatomically and genetically) turn into a herd of bulls in heat? What makes them unite under a shameful action and charge forward without any consideration to religion, morals, culture or tradition?
Oppression? Frustration? Revenge? Proving a point or just simple ignorance?
What happened to the oriental Arab values that they kept pushing down our throats? The Arab man is jealous by nature and would feel bad for the women of his country of they were treated badly or unjustly, the Arab man is always keen on protecting the women of his country even if they were not his flesh and blood, the Arab man demands that the women of his country dress modestly and cover up because that’s what religion and tradition say they should do and because they want to protect them from the wolves in the streets waiting to rape them if they showed an arm or a leg like uncovered meat calling for strayed cats to attack and rip it apart, … etc.
The Arab man this and the Arab man that … bull shit!
These guys really gave us some great examples!! From the mufti who blurted out the infamous theory of uncovered meat vs. cats, to any of those guys who committed assault against those poor women in down town Cairo a few days ago; they are no different in my opinion because they both considered women to be pieces of meat that were created to satisfy their hunger … shame on them!
What is the message that we are supposed to be getting from all of this? That women’s place is home and if she goes out, she will be violated in the worst possible way? That we have become monstrous creatures driven by their animalistic urges? What can we understand from this ugliness? They have managed to prove one point though; it is that there is no connection between violating and raping a woman and her dress code; they did not differentiate between covered or not, Muslim or not, Egyptian or not, they were hungry angry bulls in heat and fighting over the few females that were cursed to be there at the time.
What we have, is a morals crisis; we suffer from poor raising standards, no proper guidance or references, no close monitoring from the parents, illiteracy, ignorance and denial.
I have to say that I am happy that I live in Jordan; when I read about those incidents, I could not help but imagine how things will be if something like this happened here; regardless of how and where I imagine this to happen, I always came to the same conclusion; in Jordan, if something of this nature was to start, people will not wait for the police to react and interfere; they would take matters in their own hands and not only by isolating the girls and trying to protect them, but doomed is the guy or guys who attempt such a shameful irresponsible act, because they will not live enough to talk about it.
To all women in Egypt; we feel for you and support you; the ordeal you had to go through and deal with is something that we cannot easily comprehend or absorb; I cannot claim that I know how you feel because I don’t know what I would have done if I were in your place; may God bless you and the few good men who are standing up for you and the rest of us!
October 31st, 2006 at 5:35 pm
It’s so sad to see such things happening anywhere. But you have such a statement there that you know will make me respond!
There were men trying to violate the women, and men trying to protect them. And right now there are men who condemn such acts and think there are absolutely no justifications for them.
Khalidah, again and again you attack Arab men and you generalize incorrectly, you know I’m not against generalizations when they at least have the least amount of accuracy in them, but …… you know what? You win… we are all bastards … and we are all assholes
Thank you very much
October 31st, 2006 at 9:58 pm
Qwaider,
Again and again; if this incident will not make me attack men, I don’t know what should happen for me to do so!!!
Despite that; I did not generalize as you say in your comment; did you read the whole post? At least read the last 2 paragraphs
Ba3dein infala2na nesma3 7aky 3n el shahameh w el moro2a 3end el 3arab and now this happens … the majority should have been on this side, not on the aggression side .. but this is not what happened; so I guess the bad is always general and the good is always particular ..
So please let us not lose focus from the main topic and get into the “Khalidah you are attacking poor Arab men again” theory .. shall we?
October 31st, 2006 at 10:44 pm
I believe this is the real reason the veil exists: because men are too weak to control their urges. But if you cover up the women completely—therefore removing the temptation—then the problem appears to be solved. However, the real problem is the men’s lack of self control, not the women’s beauty.
The dangerous flip-side to this is the implied permission for men to lear and act shamefully when a women is uncovered. After all, “it’s her fault for being uncovered in the first place.” The idea of covering up women reverses the roll of controlled morality and places the responsibility on the woman, leaving men “innocent” in shameful and ignominious acts.
(And yes, I am generalizing. Read between the lines, people.)
October 31st, 2006 at 11:58 pm
I believe this problem goes all the way back to Adam and Eve and the depravity of human beings separated from God, choosing to act contrary to God’s laws and how He created to reflect His holiness in our actions with one another.
All men would be in this situation if it weren’t for laws and cultural stops. The law tutors us to righteousness, and helps us put down our basest desires.These Egyptian men shamelessly misused the denials of the body in Ramadan as an excuse to throw out both the laws of the land and God. What utter perversity. The police who watched it are the guiltiest of all.
Qwaider, khalidah wasn’t saying ALL men are that. I’m sure she read Sand Monkey’s and Shateely’s posts and was encouraged by the responses of men of honour. But i must saying, after living on three continents and traveling in dozens of countries, Arab men take the prize. That’s why I love Jordan Planet, because you all give me hope that there are honorable Arab men.
I blame the problem squarely on the religious leaders of Egypt. Every wierd and perverse fatwa, the most outrages imams I have heard of come from Egypt As you said Khalidah, it would never happen in Jordan.
Women (not these women, but in general)are also guilty of misusing the strengths of their gender, but where men are physically stronger and use violent force, women use the strength of emotional manipulation and withholding of sex to subvert men and cut them down.
I think men who do well to look at the model of Jesus Christ. He was single and sinless…not because God gave him special strength to keep his desires in check, the Bible says he was tempted in all ways as we are. He is the ultimate example of male singleness with sexuality channeled into action that can change the world. He validated women and affirmed them – it is a joy to look into the eyes of a man who sees you first as a precious creation of God, not a potential plaything.
It is taught in our church that the first glance at a member of the opposite sex is ok. But to look again, with the purpose of lusting, creating a 5 second sexual fantasy, is sin. Jesus said to look that way at a woman is the same as committing adultery.
I think Muslim men would do well to preach these verses from the masjid and take them to heart. Actually ask God to make them pure of mind. What a change would occur.
I also think the penalty of complete castration would help. If a man can lose a hand in Saudi for stealing, the offending member in rape should also risk the same penalty. Then men would find out that they really can control that wayward bit of their body.
November 1st, 2006 at 12:55 am
Reading about this tragic really hurts!!
and i wld like to share a couple of questions i have been asking myself related to this matter.
we cld see one punk , two..6 max being high or sth chasing any skirt. but the incident here talks about groups!!groups and many ppl involved in this.
don’t you find it strange that it was Eid el fetir when all this started?
Ramadan has never left us completely and still its spirit lives among us and we are witnessing such event!
something is fishy , though am not a big fan of conspiracy theories and all..but i have to admit , sth is wrong in the picture.
don’t you agree?
November 1st, 2006 at 12:57 am
ah and btw , happy Eid fetir khalida , yen3ad 3alaina w 3aliki bel se77a wel salameh.
salamtik men el flu kaman.
w happy new year , ad7a..kolo in one message
November 1st, 2006 at 1:06 am
There’s something fishy about it Khalidah. I find it hard to believe that Egyptian men, and not just 4 or even 10 men did such things right after Ramadan! and to make it more unbelievable, it didn’t happen once, and it didn’t happen only in one place. There’s more to it I’m sure.
November 1st, 2006 at 1:17 am
Khkokha,
I share you the rage, as I am still so angry.
I see complete failure of justice and disintigration of morality in that unfortunate incident, and letting that go by with no accountibility is a disgrace not to eygpt alone but to all Arab countries and people. It is a sign of a huge underlying crisis in our countries, that resulted from departing from the commandments of Allah. I will call the crisis “lack of real men”. I now see what khalida was referring to in her posts as she was referring to signs of the crisis surfacing and threatening our society fabric. She sounded the alarm in her own way intimidating Arab men into doing something about it.
NO MAN, NO REAL MAN will stand for what have happened in Egypt.
Islam cannot tolerate what have happened either, as it is the religion of purity and elevation of humans above the animal level. I even doubt that animals do what those did. Animals would fight to death for their females (except khanzeer). Even animal males will not force a female in such act unless she is in heat (consent).
Islam came to raise us above the animals level. Those who committed this crime has nothing to do with Islam even if they have
all the muslim names in the world. if there was an islamic state and that happened (of course in no way it would happen) they will be punished with 7ad al7irabah (sever punishment) and they will be set as an example to all who dare to commit such a crime. But lack of justice and lack of men who demands justice encourged such savagery.
Qwaider yes Khalida was right in her stand
as she saw what you didn’t see and failed to see (as you taking it as rivlary). She saw lack of: justice, morality, manhood, and above all faith. We do have a crisis of “lack of Real Men’. Qwaider, I usually stand with you on some arguments, but not this one this time.
It’s clear Arab women lack real Arab men, we have great numbers of males but few are men. As you know if there are enough Men in our society non of that would have happened. We have failed our beloved prophet’s SAAW last will which he emphasized so clearly “estawsu benisa2e khairan” he didnt say, missuse them, beat the heck out of them, rape them in public, tourment them, take their wealth and earnings, humilate them, he didnt say any of that. So how we can face our Lord Allah and his prophet on the day of judgement? we have violated his commands on all levels in the name of culture.
Let’s remember that Islam only religion that gurantee women their rights and give them due respect. Islam only system that makes civilized Men out of males. I refuse to call any of those males Muslim MEN as they don’t qualify.
And WE refuse the injustice that is imposed on women with the name of culture.
The only thing I recognise and support is what islam granteed women. We reject as well any interference in our socities by forginers in the name of “Women Rights” as there is no way they can grant women what Islam granted them for the past 1400 years. We need to clean house, as its shame on us if we suppress our beloved women their rights who our beloved kept stressing ” Ma akramahuna ela kareem, wa ma ahanahuna ela la2eem”
Again I sympathize with all Arab women who are holding on accepting males in marriage becasue they don’t qualify as MEN. I encourage all women ready for marriage to seek Muslim Man who sincerely prescribe to Islam.
Please, accept our apology Khalida as we missunderstood you. And please have faith as well, there are still some good men around that honor women as our beloved prophet SAAW has instructed, and commanded. Those men are the ones who take Islam as a way of life rather than a way to arguement and empty talking.
Love for all, as I have not intended to insult no one, but the crisis is deep rooted and it needs the attention and help of all men and women who care to rectify it.
November 1st, 2006 at 3:04 am
I was stunned by the news especially that I leave tomorrow to Cairo, a city that I really like and feel safe walking in its street. I cant imagine how those women must have felt. Some ebyptian bloggers say similer incidents happened after the Eid. They also mentioned old incidents (ma3adi and 3atabah) where girls were raped infront of people and noone did anything.
November 1st, 2006 at 5:51 am
“The Arab man this and the Arab man that … bull shit!”
We are all bastards…. I hope you’re happy now
PS: shouldn’t you be attacking the riots not men in specific? The police for not interfering? the authority for allowing things like this to happen?
No, it’s only men …. fine … as you wish
November 1st, 2006 at 6:16 am
Qwaider,
Last time I checked; it was men who started the so called riot, it is men who followed the initiators and added to the riot, it is policeMEN who stood there and did nothing, it is men in authority who allowed this to happen … and women were the victims to all of the above-mentioned
Hmmmm … I wonder why I attack men!! ma ely 7a2 wallah
For the last time Qwaider, do not try to turn this into something that it is not by shifting the focus from the real issue and starting another “bash Khalidah for hating Arab men” campaign ..
As Abdullah said above, these so called males do not deserve to be called men in the first place ..
And I have already said that in Jordan, none of this would happen because we still have it in us .. we still have a few good men .. just like Egypt has a few of them who are standing up and saying something instead of attacking those who are trying to do something positive …
So will you give it a rest and stop trying to turn anything I say on MY BLOG into an opportunity for you to bash me … this issue is a lot bigger than you and me .. so please treat it as such …
November 1st, 2006 at 6:42 am
Who’s changing this into bashing poor khalidah post! IF anyone is doing that bashing … it’s not me …
I’m not bashing you, I never did, but you like to take it that way … then sure .. by all means. You’re steering it in that direction not me!
What makes you so sure it will not happen in Jordan? Are we better “men” here than Egyptians? don’t you think that’s extremely racist of you to say!? Ok, lets not dwell on that
Your blog or not your blog …. when you say something wrong … don’t expect people to just accept it … Sorry, you’re not a saint .. and you do say absurd and wrong things at times … and do come with wrong conclusions .. just like everyone else!
Aal bashing you …. !! look who’s doing the bashing … poor innocent khalidah
November 1st, 2006 at 6:53 am
Qwaider,
One more time; may this finally get to you … this is not about me … stop turning it into that direction
But you know what; the best way to answer you is by not answering you because you will continue to come up with the same scenarios you always manage to do …
So if I say men are doing bad things then I am a man hater .. and if I say we still have few good men in our country .. then I am a racist .. what is it with you?
I never claimed I was a saint .. I never claimed that everything I say is right .. I am expressing my own personal opinion .. I guess I am entitled for that … don’t accept it .. that’s fine .. but abstain from saying things that are not related to the main issue … and stop saying “poor innocent Khalidah” .. in fact .. 6alle3ny mn rasak ya akhy .. efft!!! (copyrights to Hala – Rambling Hal)
November 1st, 2006 at 7:03 am
Hi Khalidah,
can I say my opinion here ??
I’m sure you are unlike other Arab bloggers who can listen to opinions that contradicts their opinions, and I will always have hope on you.
I will summarize my point of view:
I wonder why girls are complaining from Arab men! I have a small solution, why don’t they just go to America and get married to non Arab guys ?? who would prevent them ?? nobody!
And about the meat issue I wonder , again, why Arab girls are always complaining from the Hijab thing! why are they making big deal out of nothing ?? If they don’t like Hijab, then they can simply not wear it , w 5alas! and they shouldn’t be angry from those other girls who LIKES Hijab and likes wearing it, sa7 ? kol wa7ad 7orr. and I really don’t know why some arabs don’t consider that Australian Sheikh freedom of speech and consider the nasty Danish cartoon freedom of speech (thought Im against that Sheikh’s opinon and the dirty Danish cartoon).
That might sound out of context, and Im sorry for this! but all I wanted to say is, don’t spark your rage on Arab men !!
this incident in Egypt, I would love to trust the news I get through “blogs” , but I simply can’t. I’ve seen that little program on Dream TV, and Im sad for it.
Speaking of few good men, Blogging about the issue doesn’t make a hero out of Guy, and doesn’t indicate anything at all!! right ??
sorry for the long comment!
November 1st, 2006 at 7:07 am
how come the topic turned to be a men-hater topic??
we are talking about a social phenomena that occured recently in egypt.
as i can see , khalida’s main thoughts were directed at [i]those[/i] men who were there and did nothing!!
**sorry i had to express what i think,though it is not my business.
but the topic -which i am interested in- is diverting and we are now discussing the endless sterile equation between men and women.
November 1st, 2006 at 7:32 am
It’s not personal, it’s far from it.
Khalidah, Calm down a little bit and try to see my point. Which apparently you’re able to navigate skillfully around
My point is that your “style” is Arab-male unfriendly. Cool?
I started by saying, It’s sad to see this happen anywhere
I don’t support and totally condemn it
And Think people should be punished because there is no justification
Now after that I said: that you are attacking Arab men indescriminatly. Even the ones who are enraged by this, even the ones who had nothing to do with it. Even the ones who were fighting the angry mob!
Yes, those were men doing that. Absolutely, but not all men were doing that. (does this make it clearer)?
And the matter of “atall3ek” min rasi, is up to me, you have the right to say what ever you want, and I have the right to have an opnion about it! you may efft all you like! I’m not giving that up.
How about this little story, During the Yarmouk university riots, several female students were assaulted and raped by members of 7aras el badyeh. These ware servicemen on duty. And follow a chain of command nor riots. I don’t think that gives us (Jordanians) the higher grounds any more. (although I have to state thatI am ashamed of any person who does such acts)
Again and again Khalidah, it’s not about you. It was never about you. It’s about what you write, you can be a man heater/lover/agnostic all you like it doesn’t mean anything to me. What matters to me is my right to defend men when they’re unjustly accused or stereotyped.
I don’t think I erred there! And I don’t think you were fully fair to Arab men.
November 1st, 2006 at 8:07 am
Asalam 3alaykom,
khalidah..please calm down and listen to me..
1- It is not proper to attack the mufti..because..even..and i say even..if he was wrong..he will answer to allah and believe me al3olama2 must be on our heads cause no matter how educated or smart we are..we will never reach their standards..
**the mufti didn’t say we were pieces of meat..he never said we should cover up…ALLAH SAID WE SHOULD COVER UP!!
And every lady is free to follow allah or not..humans shouldn’t make that judgment..allah will.
2- What you know about the cairo chaos is short!!
Other very very very sirious circumstances were behind this disgusting hateful accident…but i won’t bad mouth my own country when no one knows anything about that..
**when u say arab men..you do generalize..as i can’t take a pervert and say arab man!!
i can’t say a thief..and say arab man..well they are arabs but they are not examples..cause they are the exception not the base…they are the minority..not the majority..
And believe me..this horrible thing can happen anywhere..no place is excluded from having a scarey event happening…who would have thought that the bombing that happened in amman could happen before??!!
not me..i can tell u that..may allah forbidd that happening to any country..
Anyway..Arab men are of the same value as arab women..as we among our gender have disasters as well if not more serious!!
Arab men are ..my dad..my brother..my lover…all the great men i know..who are out there..maybe having flaws…like any other men all over the world..just like i have flaws like any other woman around the world..
I hate the men who did that horrifying thing down town cairo..but i don’t hate arab men!!
Thanks for feeling for us..you have a good heart..may allah bless you
November 1st, 2006 at 9:11 am
Abed,
You are always welcome here
When I complain about Arab men, it is not because I hate them and want to marry a non-Arab, it is because I hate the state they have reached, hence; the state that the whole community reached. you might argue that women are not better and you are right, however; we say in Arabic; El faras mn el fares, so that goes back to men as well .. what makes me angry is that the good guys are becoming less and less every day .. I talk may someone listen and do something .. instead they leave the main issue and attack me for generalizing which is completely beside the point …
Regarding Hijab, I do not hate it at all and in fact; I wrote a whole post about discrimination against mu7ajabat .. if I am not ma7ajabeh, this does not mean that I am against it or those who wear it … the Australian mufti’s statement angered me because he dehumanized both men and women .. get my point?
The incident in Egypt: when I referred to the few good men, it was not only the bloggers; but also those who sheltered the girls and tried to protect them and those who are speaking out might they induce some change .. I hope you can see where I am coming from now
Thank you for passing by
November 1st, 2006 at 9:14 am
Rana,
Wallah I don’t know how it was turned to something against me or a women-men issue .. some commentors take only one part of my post and dwell on it .. hence diverting attention to something completely different from the topic and starting a debate that is completely unrelated
November 1st, 2006 at 9:22 am
Qwaider,
That’s what I was trying to tell you .. it is not personal .. but you keep shifting towards that ..
It seems that although you are a regular reader/commentor on my blog; you still don’t GET my style … No, it is not Arab Men Unfriendly …
In my post; I thanked the men who were trying to help .. and I hope that this time you will get my point once and for all .. stop giving us words and cliches and do something .. actions speak louder than words and these recent actions in Egypt were very loud that they got us deaf .. I am entitled to feel angry …
Ma beddak t6alle3ny mn rasak .. fine .. that would be your problem
Your little story is not nice and I don’t think I buy it … but hey .. it is not less shameful and if it is true then they too are equally as bad ..
Newsflash; what I write is a part of who I am .. so if you think that is separate from me, then you are way off … and get it through your head .. I do not hate anyone .. I am just pointing out alarming facts from my perspective .. and by the way; you are not defending men; you are attacking me, that’s why it becomes personal .. hope that is clear enough this time!!!
November 1st, 2006 at 9:27 am
You cannot say that this would never happen in Jordan. Where are those “knights in shinine aromour” when girls are violated in the streets….yes I said VIOLATED. With words and the ever staring that takes place there. I don’t see anyone coming to the rescue of those gals who have to deal with guys uttering obscene words or checking out girls from head to toe. I fully grasp that there is a huge difference between the physical attacks in Egypt and the verbal harrassment that takes place, but tell that to the poor girls who walk these guntlets all the time. The animal perps are the same in my eyes.
November 1st, 2006 at 9:29 am
The Caller,
This is not about hijab; I talked about the mufti because he dehumanized both men and women .. and his argument was silly and offensive .. one that hurt our image as Muslims .. that’s not acceptable ..
As for the Cairo incident; regardless of the reasons ya Rasha, what happened is disgusting and should be condemned and rejected by everyone … we are not animals
I am not generalizing because I said that there are still good men out there who are trying to make a difference and they did not stand there and watch without doing anything ..
I do not and I repeat .. I do not hate Arab men .. it is just that certain commentors stirred some of the debates on my blog in that direction .. I hate the state that we reached as an Arab community .. and yes a huge part of it is on the men’s shoulders .. they should be way better and if these things could happen anywhere; they must not happen to us as Muslims and Arabs .. that’s why my anger is magnified
If we did not feel for each other .. then who will .. I am really angry and we should not calm down; instead; we should do something .. all of us!!
November 1st, 2006 at 9:47 am
No one is attacking you Khalidah …
November 1st, 2006 at 12:50 pm
Thanks for your answer Khalida.
I still think that a blog doesn’t indicate whether or not the blogger is a “good” guy and shouldn’t be considered a reliable source of news.
and I didn’t mean you personally with the Hijab thing, Im just talking about vas majority of girls who hate Hijab.
of course the number of good men are few, and this has nothing to do with being Arab. Also the number of good girls is very few. We (guys) are facing many frustrations with girls due to the shallowness and many other factors, this is out of the scope of this comment.
thx anyway
November 1st, 2006 at 12:58 pm
Explanatory Statement by the Mufti Al-Hilaly
Regarding the Recent Media Campaign
I would like to outline clearly and plainly some of the facts and basics that formulate my faith, belief and my understanding of the teachings of the true religion of Islam:
1-The crime of rape against any woman is an abominable crime; it has no justification, and the perpetrator deserves the severest punishment and would not deserve to belong to a religion or to humanity.
2-Women in Australia or any other western society are free to wear what they like, and no Muslim has the right to dictate the rulings of his religion on others. While non-Muslim women can cover or reveal whatever they choose of their bodies, Islamic Shari’a made it incumbent upon Muslim men to lower their gaze. It is prohibited for them to stare at the beauty of strange women.
3- It is my duty as a religious leader to advise Muslim women to adhere to and abide by the Islamic dress code. Having said that, Muslim women are free to comply with or reject my advice, and their reckoning will be with Allah the Almighty.
4-By saying the “exposed meat” displayed in a degrading way is a simile for a woman, making herself subject to abuse by men with diseased souls whose animalistic instincts will overcome them whereby they would abandon their humanity, mind and religion. These men are responsible for their crime.
5-The metaphor I used of the “exposed meat” was not appropriate for the western mentality. It has been quoted and misinterpreted by some groups with ill intentions. This metaphor was used in a private lesson given inside the mosque after the Taraweeh (optional night) prayers on the fourth day of Ramadan. It was meant for the Muslim attendees at the mosque and not the general public and particularly not the general women of our Australian society.
Apart from the above-mentioned facts, I would like to make it known to all my brothers and sisters in and out of Australia that:
After the Taraweeh (optional night) prayers on 27/09/2006, at the Lakemba Mosque in Sydney, Australia, I gave a lesson to the members of the Islamic community of Australia, the title of which was: “Why did Allah, the Almighty, mention ‘man’ before ‘woman’ in the crime of theft? as is quoted in the Quran: {[As for] the thief, the male and the female, …} [Al-Ma’idah 5.38] while He mentioned ‘woman’ before ‘man’ in the crime of adultery?, as is quoted in the Quran: {The woman and the man found guilty of adultery or fornication, …} [An-Nur 24.2]”.
This lesson lasted approximately 15 minutes; 10 minutes of these were spent on explaining the meaning of the first verse, and the remaining time was spent on giving advice and guidance relating to the way a woman dresses and the methods of seduction and the beauty given to her by the Almighty Allah. I emphasised that exceeding the limits in this regard is dangerous to both men and women; and that the devil exploits these charms of seduction to tempt both men and women to commit adultery and fornication. In this case, both men and women are committing a sin. So the topic did not deal with the crime of rape.
At the end of the lesson when I was explaining the reason why ‘woman’ was mentioned before ‘man’ in the verse dealing with the crime of adultery, I said it was because she possessed the charm, the methods of seduction and all similar devices given to her by Allah to tempt the man. For that I borrowed a metaphor used by an author called Ar-Rifa’i. He said exposing the meat in an illicit way would encourage the cats to devour it. I didn’t mean by that to humiliate the immodest women; I meant to censure the person who would abandon his humanity and turn into a vicious animal; and there’s a big difference between a cat’s behaviour and that of a human’s, as the latter is commanded and responsible for their actions.
I confess that this analogy is inappropriate and unacceptable for the Australian society and the western society in general.
I am deeply saddened and distressed by the acts of some devious groups which lurk in the dark watching me, and who cannot tolerate the moderate balanced way which I adopt to advocate for women’s issues, national harmony and co-existence, and to hold fast to the love of our Australian home, to protect it from all forms of extreme thoughts and to reject all acts of violence and any act that breaches the rule of law.
Yes, I feel deeply saddened that such an ordinary lesson has been used to slander and defame me after it had been translated with the ill intention of a dubious media that wishes to incite and they present an unfair campaign, the aims of which are very well known.
Once again, I turn to all the women of Australia and the world. You are the shining lights of the world, you are more than half of the society, and you are the daughters, the sisters, the mothers and the aunts. How could any sane person think of humiliating you?
You are the cherished pearls, the dearest thing in the world. So don’t be taken as offerings at the temples of the merchants of pleasure, or advocates of decadence and corruption.
Each one of us is responsible for accounting for his or her own actions before he or she is asked about them by the almighty Allah (on the Day of Judgment). Once again I am very sorry and apologize for what resulted from an unintentional analogy.
With all my respect to the women of the world.
In due course I will take the necessary decision that shall lift the pressures that have been placed on our Australian Muslim community and that which will benefit all Australians.
The pressure of the last couple of days has had an obvious effect on my health and well-being. I ask the public to give my family and I some privacy, time and space to recover. I have also asked for indefinite leave from my duties at Lakemba mosque.
Sincerely
Sheikh Taj El-Deen El-Hilali
Mufti Of Australia
November 1st, 2006 at 1:00 pm
Qwaider,
True, no one is attacking me, just you!!!!!!!
Abed,
You are welcome
November 2nd, 2006 at 1:33 am
Kinzi,
“It is taught in our church that the first glance at a member of the opposite sex is ok. But to look again, with the purpose of lusting, creating a 5 second sexual fantasy, is sin. Jesus said to look that way at a woman is the same as committing adultery.
I think Muslim men would do well to preach these verses from the masjid and take them to heart. Actually ask God to make them pure of mind. What a change would occur.”
These things are preached in the masjid. Our prophet -asws- said that a muslim is only allowed the first glance, implying that looking again because a person found something he liked is forbidden.
Anyway, I’m not sure what that Australian mufti said and what relation it has to what happened in Egypt. But I think there is truth in the cat/meat thing (besides the fact that it’s a gross simplfication).. ever heard of Woodstock (a music festival in USA)? It’s a living example of this.
It is notorious for how much rape happens there, and I saw it on CNN once. The report focused on both sides (the meat and the cat if you will, hehe) highlighting the behavior of females in this festival; provocative -lack of- clothes and getting topless and such actions. Of-course I’m not likening this to what happened in Egypt, but lighten up a little; lissa fee khair fil dinya.
November 2nd, 2006 at 6:44 am
It seems as if, of all of the good things that can come from the West, that only this type of stuff is exported.
The very same thing happened a few years ago in New York, men went on a rampage and assaulted women, although I guess they were less “lucky” than those poor women in Cairo, in this case in New York, several women were actually raped.
November 2nd, 2006 at 11:31 pm
Samer, if this is what is preached than the situation is worse than I thought. Then 99% of Muslim men in Amman are disregarding the preaching of their religious leaders. I took in informal poll on a blog once, asking if they had ever asked God’s help in keepingpure thoughts, not one answered yes. No matter what is taught, men feel that somehow their minds are uncontrollable and even God can’t help them.
Lighten up? Tht very statement reveals the societal problem. Yes, there is good in the world, but most of it falls to men. God is good to women, but I see a complete lack of willingness of muslim men to follow the teaching of considering all women to be treated llike sisters and mothers.
I’m an American, I’ve lived there rather than just observing Woodstock on CNN. People who attend Woodstock are not your go-to-church-Sunday Christians, they go in order to participate in wildness. The women in Cairo were just going about their business, and many were covered. In America, I have never been called sexual names, leared at, followed, stalked, groped – for me in Amman, sexual harassment is a way of life.
Samer, may God help you to be a man of change and honor.
Abu Sinan, I’m surprised you would consider this activity a Western import. If anything it is an Eastern import, since this region is the cradle of civilization and moved out West. In my opinion, it is a depravity of man issue, not cultural.
Abu Sinan, please go read the comments in Sand Monkeys blog about more details of the Central Park rampage, there are some telling details there.
November 3rd, 2006 at 7:56 am
kinzi , with all due respect, I found your comment above in contradiction. One one hand you assure the readers that”99% of Muslim men in Amman are disregarding the preaching of their religious leaders”
Yet defending when it comes to Christians “People who attend Woodstock are not your go-to-church-Sunday Christians, they go in order to participate in wildness.”, I would say that in both societies there are some misguided souls but not that we have 99% of our men misguided. This a unjust characterization my friend and I ask you to retrieve it or qualify it properly. And thanks to west for exporting their way of life to our countries that you see such kind of misguided souls.
We have maintained morality through ages in our societies because of Islam, and we departed from them because of adopting the Western ways that degraded our lives. Just show me one incident that ” Christian West” introduced one good morality in our societies
look at what they export to us in Movies, TV shows, and the Western minded people in control in our societies they keep failing of selecting what ever left in values in the West.
I am not a hater of the West, we as Muslims would love putting our hands in other religions hands to combat immorality, yet we reject this sense of self-righteousness that any side takes.
Our scholars has their hands tied, as they are restrained from preaching in an effective way from pro-West governments, while they propagate all of the west filth freely.
November 3rd, 2006 at 11:16 am
Abdullah, I am sorry for what you see as an unjust characterization. Let me attempt to clarify. My point being that America ceased to be a Christian nation long ago, if it ever was. The number of people who actually follow Christ (submitting themselves to His teachings, give generously, pray consistently, pratice bible study) isn’t over 15% at the maximum.
Since you mention movies and TV, let’s see: if you look at media, the entertainment industry, government and educators, the numbers drop to less than 1%. So is it Christianity or secularism that exports this junk? And remember supply and demand…if people didn’t buy it, the industry would die. I haven’t watched much more than PG13 rated films, and NO network or cable TV, in 25 years because it doesn’t fit my value system.
There is no such thing as “the Christian West”. Europe began the slide long ago. In spite of all the hullabaloo over President Bush being a Christian and Evangelicals taking over the world, it just ain’t so. If it was, our children would be able to bring Bibles to school and still call December 25 “Christmas” instead of the Winter Holiday.
I’m glad you don’t hate the West, I do hate what the West has become. I hate teh fact that my country has become one that has turned freedom into freedom to sin. What good our country did export is work ethic, creativity, trying again after failure.
But the problem here is that there are a lot of Muslims who are living as practical atheists (gotta run, low battery)
November 3rd, 2006 at 12:22 pm
Abdullah, so I hope that makes my point clearer. Jordan is 95% Muslim nation, America is 15% Christian and 85% unchurched, meaning untaught in Christian theology.
If it is true, as Samer says, that it is preached from your mosques to look twice is sin, and men stare and speak perversely and touch females to the level I know they do, there IS a problem. I am a middle-aged woman dressed conservatively, not a hot twenty year old in tight pants, an dthere are times I just don’t want to leave the house knowing the degradation I will face in the streets.In God-rejecting America, it doesn’t happen.
I doubt that there haven’t been these problems in the whole history of Islam. It isn’t the West that perverted Islam, it was satan’s influence in the hearts of men since the beginning.
If truth is being spoken in mosques and not applied in life, it is not the fault of the West. No one has tied the hands of the scholars in Amman. The mosque leader in our neighborhood delivers the most boring sermons I’ve ever heard.
Abdullah, I so desire to see Jordanian men become men of honor, to become the kind of men you wrote about in your first post on this thread.American men need to regain their honor also. I will look to you to be a mentor to young men who need this modeled.
I will retract my 99% statement. But only to 75%…as today as I drove by three mosques letting out, men didn’t just stare, but stopped to stare (and even blocked my car once) until I drove by. At the mall, it was comment after comment.
That’s why I like to read blogs, so I can relate to Muslim men as human beings and they to me. And all the JP men I have met have been very honorable.God bless you as you hunger and thrst for righteousness.
November 3rd, 2006 at 1:48 pm
Kinzi,
thank you for your good wishes. I really appreciate that you acknowledge the importance of religion. I’ve gotten used to western and western-minded people accusing Islam for honour killings, ill-treatment of women and every other vice. It’s a nice change to see someone telling us to stick to the teachings instead.
Abdullah, I disagree with you that there isn’t good morality in the west. I think that there is a lot we can learn from them and that there is a lot that they can learn from us, in return. There’s this story which I don’t know the particulars of.. a muslim traveller or something goes to the Arab world and to the West, and says about them respectively “I found Islam, but didn’t find muslims.” and “I found muslims, but didn’t find Islam”
I’ve experienced that, I’ve been to Kansas once, every passerby in the street smiles and greets you, and you find more honesty in the streets there than you do here. It is a sad truth that just looking at a passerby in the eyes to say hello or smile is in itself a mental challenge here, even though smiling gives us hasanat and God and the Prophet -asws- ordered us to greet people around us.
Kinzi, it is really unfortunate that these things happen to you and around you as frequently as you describe. I don’t know where these things happen, but I always advice Euro or American female acquantances against going to places like down town or Raghadan, even though they are ‘tourist attractions’ sort of. ‘It’ is fierce in these places…
November 3rd, 2006 at 2:06 pm
Sorry Khalida for repeating myself again, but this is everyone who reads this and comments on this entry:
Im sick of all this RACISM & HATE against Muslims & Islam, this is a religion for god sake!
Islam never ever forced anyone to join it, so IF YOU DON’T LIKE MUSLIMS & Islam, simply don’t become one & keep your opinion and precious jewels of wisdome for yourself.
just leave us alone, we don’t need your advices, morals, human rights, civilization, democracy,starbucks, bars, beauty, and humor.
Im speaking about Arabs and anyone who hate Islam. If you are Arab and wish to change your religion , just go live in the West and enjoy your life, nobody will miss you, take my words on this.
Please enjoy these things and just leave us alone, we’ll be happy for you. Leave us alone and nobody will mess with your wonderful life. Leave us alone and everybody will thank you.
Mind you own business, judge your own morals (if there’s any) , judge the behavior of your men, correct your economoy , and try to change your corrupted governments of war & internationl terrorism before judging us.
November 3rd, 2006 at 2:27 pm
Abed,
My dear, calm down
This is not a war or something .. it is really good and healthy to exchange ideas and thoughts
I found your comment a bit harsh although you did not specify whom you are addressing with it .. however; I approved it because you deserve to be heard like everyone else and this way, they will get the chance to discuss your ideas …
Thank you for passing by
November 4th, 2006 at 1:49 am
Khalidah, Im talking to anybody who hates Islam and Muslims. I didn’t address to a specific one, but It’s sick to see hatered against Islam and Muslims wherever you go! I’ve read my comment again, I admit it’s a little bit harsh, you can delete it if you want! bas fa2a3na mn hal ossa! islam islam wain ma enroo7
November 4th, 2006 at 10:53 am
Abed,
It’s OK my dear
You can always vent here … feel free
November 4th, 2006 at 2:59 pm
Abed. Hamden, I understand your hunger to see your faith dignified and respected. I don’t know if I was one of the ones you were referring to. I don’t think I qualify as a hater of Islam, and certainly not of Muslims – but I hope that you can see that bringing up problems isn’t so much hate or racism, or slinging junk; it is redemptive interms of acknowledging a problem is the first step to real change.
That may be another ‘pearl of wisdom’ you don’t want to hear. My purpose in discussing depravity in any society is to provoke longing for change. I am much harsher on my own culture than yours. It sounds as if you hunger for a righteous ummah as much as you do for dignity and respect. One more pearl: Jesus said “Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be filled”. May you be filled, Abed.
November 5th, 2006 at 1:40 am
Dear kinzi,
I really respect your on look on morlaity, as it is similar to mine.
I just want to register one point here, Muslim Scholars, (not boring government appointed preachers) does not have the 1/1000000 of what the western Christian preachers have in resources, money and TV stations and they managed to keep a good % of the people in check with their faith and morality, yet the opposite is happening in the West.
Don’t you agree with me that is a good achievement? And Instead of the Christian organizations in the west spend their money and efforts on spreading Morality in the West, they are spending it on trying to convert Muslims in Muslim countries to Christianity, and printing fake Quran’s. Not only that they resort to such tactics, but they have showed their ugly faces in attacking Muslims and Islam publicly on their TV shows 24/7.
They are trying to demonize Islam and Muslims and attacking the person of our beloved Prophet SAAW.
The west thinks Islam is dying in the East and trying to take its chance to finish it by so many means and spending billions of dollars for that goal including occupying its countries.
Its the new era crusade that Bush is leading as it was evident from his speeches (see his profile as well in Time magazine) and from the speeches of the leaders of Christianity in USA that represent about 70 million people and they were behind his election and gave him support to invade the EVIL MUSLIMS and destroy their ISLAM as they claimed.
We in the west has been watching with utmost concern the rabid attack on Islam and Muslims and even the LORD Allah in Christian TV channels and Radios, in an unprecedented fashion in history of the United States of America.
With all that said I still say lets join hands in spreading morality as that is the basis for survival of societies.
Top Morality that needs to prevail if you agree with me is JUSTICE, which I think in the USA its almost going to zero. ( I hope you agree on that as well)
Have a good day!
November 5th, 2006 at 1:45 am
Brother Samer,
As for USA that you know when you were in the USA kiss it goodby. We have a differnet reality now, I advice you to talk to people living there still they can fill you up.
November 6th, 2006 at 7:26 am
Kinzi,
I don’t know if you hate Islam or if you are muslim or not. and I was not personally referring to you.
I would love to bring problems, and talk about them. It’s not bringing up problems, It’s the way problems are brought up. There’s a difference between someone who want to have discussion and seek answers and other one who want just to insult and fight.
Im always having discussions, and most of my discussion are with Jews btw. I have no problem with discussions or talking about problems. My problem is with those who always want to fight and use propaganda to increase hatered against Islam and Muslims.
And what I’ve seen so far is nothing but Judging Islam out of judging a small portion of Muslims.
Thanks for informing me of that statement of Jesus (Pbuh), I never heared this before.
December 4th, 2006 at 10:56 pm
By nature women are mass manipulator’s. Men have the audacity to speak the truth without being politically correct.It is a shame that the word’s used by the mufti were ignoble.
Let there be gender equality and the true color of women will come out.Throughout human existence men have been the creators, I would love to see women be better at creating rather than nurturing.
With gender equality you will easily see women lose their own morality ( women have no morals because they live life on flexible values changing from one moment to another ).Men will also notice that women are more likely to fall for carnal desires than men do.